Andromeda Galaxy Group has Blue Shift - Update
This is a follow-up to the 3/18 post about the Andromeda galaxy group being unique. There are no blue shift objects in the universe outside of our Local Group.
This exercise checks the local group.
I found a reference for the local group. It had 35 objects with their right ascension, declination, relative velocity, estimated distance.
Of the 35, 16 had blue shift, 11 had red shift, 8 were missing that value in the reference.
Among those missing are And I, And II, And III, And V, And VI, so I can only wonder if they were not sampled due to proximity to M31.
I did not attempt to calculate distances between 2 objects based on differences in RA and in declination, along with their respective distances from Earth.
There are several objects with a red shift and they are probably not near Andromeda.
There are several objects with a blue shift and they are apparently relatively near Andromeda.
This is just a coarse analysis of the local group motions.
Perhaps someday these distances can be calculated.
Andromeda galaxy M31 has a relative velocity of -205
according to the reference.
( https://arxiv.org/ftp/astro-ph/papers/9908/9908050.pdf )
However another references(wikipedia) has M31 at -301 km/sec, not -205. That is not a big difference but I have no way to resolve a difference and with no way to determine the 'correct' source, plus the author might have used resources more accurate than Wikipedia. I left the velocity data as published.
I can provide only what I can find.
I tried to change the positions in the reference document to differences to Andromeda, to make that simple comparison easier by the general area.
This exercise is only relative velocities and relative positions.
This is a preliminary analysis based on what is available.
Vr = velocity as relative value; + is red shift or recession.
Vr=- value is blue shift
D2 = distance to object, in Mpc
Vr=M = missing data
DIG is dwarf Irregular Galaxy
DS is dwarf spherical galaxy
This is the spread around the local group, relative to M31, starting at the opposite point in azimuth so M31 is in the middle of the list. There are 35 objects in the reference.
Its right ascension is 00h 42m; its declination is 41d 16m
AD values are from object to M31, to nearest hour or degree
D+ value indicates object has higher declination than M31.
name / position relative to M31 / vel. / distance
DDO 199 A-9h D+26d Vr=-247 D2=0.06blue
DDO 208 Ah Dd Vr=-293 D2= 0.08blue
sagittarius-DS A-6h D71d Vr=+142 D2= 0.03red +d
SAG-DIG A-5h D-58d Vr=-79 D2= 1.40blue
NGC 6822 Ah D-55d Vr=-56 D2= 0.50blue
DDO 210 Ah Dd Vr=-131 D2= 1.02blue
Tucana-DS A-4h D-105d Vr=M D2=0.87miss -d
And VII A-1h D9d Vr= M D2=0.69miss
DDO 216 Ah Dd Vr=-182 D2= 0.76blue
And VI A-1h D-17d Vr=M D2= 0.83miss
DDO221 A0h D-56d Vr=-120 D2= 0.93blue
UGC 192 A0h D+18d Vr=-344 D2= 0.66blue
NGC 185 A0h D-7d Vr=-193 D2= 0.66blue
And III A0h D-5d Vr=M D2= 0.76miss
NGC 185 A0h D+7d Vr=-202 D2= 0.22blue
NGC 205 A0h D0d Vr=-244 D2= 0.76blue
M32 A0h D0d Vr=-205 D2= 0.76blue
M31 Andromeda A0h D0d Vr=-301 D2= 0.76 blue M31
And I A0h D-3d Vr=M D2= 0.81miss
SMC a0h d-113d Vr=148 D2= 0.06blue
Sculptor A+1h D-74d Vr=+110 D2= 0.09red-d
LGS 3 A+1h D-20d Vr=-286 D2= 0.81blue
IV1613 A+1h D-39d Vr=-232 D2= 0.72blue
And V A+1h D+6d Vr=M D2= 0.81miss
And II A+1h D-8d Vr=M D2= 0.70miss
M33 A+1h D-11d Vr=-181 D2= 0.79 M33blue
PhoenixDS A+1h D-85d Vr=M D2= 0.4miss
Fornax DS A+2h D-75d Vr=+53 D2= 0.14red-d
LMC A+5h D-110d Vr=+275 D2= 0.05red-d
Carina A+6h D-91d Vr=+223 D2= 0.10red-d
Leo A DDO 69 A+9h D-71d Vr=+24 D2= 0.69 red-d
Leo I DS A+10h D-29d Vr=+287 D2= 0.25 red =-d
Sextans DS A+10h D-42d Vr=+226 D2= 0.09red +h
Leo II DDO 93 A+11h D-19d Vr=+76 D2= 0.21red +h
UrsaMi DDO 199 A+15h D+26d Vr=-247 D2= 0.06 blue
Draco DDO 208 A+17h D+26d Vr=-293 D2= 0.08 blue
sagittarius-DS A+18h D-71d Vr=+142 D2= 0.03 red-d
red +h indicates RA diff is many = +h
red-d indicates dec is many -d
find references to these 2 recent additions to the Local Group but they are not in the reference; I found their data in Wikipedia or online
they are not included in the summary above to distinguish data from one source from this later separate reference
and also these appear distant
UGCA 86 A+4h D+26d Vr=+67 D2=2.60red far
Tucana II A+22h D-105d Vr=+130 D2=0.98red-d
I did not actually try to plot all the objects in space.
Maybe my estimation of distance in 3-D was incorrect.
Regardless of whether objects are close enough there is an apparent pattern.
I find it incredible all blue shift objects among the entire universe are in the Local Group.
The obvious question is how can this be?
Is this a case of intrinsic blue shift or some phenomenon caused by the local 'space'?
Perhaps you can explain to me how one listens or looks back in time - and whether that has any meaning.
When we talked with astronauts on the moon there were noticeable delays. I don't recall we had to deal with talking back in time because of the moon distance.
something ten billion lightyears
Shows newly small forming galaxies in the early young universe
Nothing to do with sound and little effect with astronauts
Halton Arp showed high red shift objects are the youngest. As they move away from their parent galaxy they grow and their red shift reduces.
High red shifts are not back in time but a reflection of their age. As their red shift drops astronomers make the simple assumption they are getting closer to earth. The observation of high red shift objects in front of low red shift objects clearly falsifies that assumption.
Red shifts are more complicated than assumed.
Someone else responded with a linked video I had not seen:
..Halton Arp link
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